Anime style custom target test version

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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby joepal » Tue Dec 29, 2015 10:02 am

Oscalon wrote:Here's the latest WIP. Starting to experiment with Collar bones, but I've mostly been working on the hair and materials, which isn't really related to this custom target. Spherical eyes remain an issue, as currently her face is too flat and doesn't work as well as I'd like from profile angles. Still trying to reconcile that.

Nep_WIP-3.png


Some things might be easier to do with a normal map, rather than physical deformations.

If you take a look at the collar bone area at Manuel's demo babe (http://www.makehuman.org/manuel_bastioni_gallery.php), you can see the results.

I don't have access to the model, nor the normal map, but from early versions, I'm pretty sure most of the prominence of the bones/indentations around the neck is due to normalmap rather than vertex shifts.
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby Oscalon » Tue Dec 29, 2015 10:10 am

joepal wrote:
Oscalon wrote:Here's the latest WIP. Starting to experiment with Collar bones, but I've mostly been working on the hair and materials, which isn't really related to this custom target. Spherical eyes remain an issue, as currently her face is too flat and doesn't work as well as I'd like from profile angles. Still trying to reconcile that.

Nep_WIP-3.png


Some things might be easier to do with a normal map, rather than physical deformations.

If you take a look at the collar bone area at Manuel's demo babe (http://www.makehuman.org/manuel_bastioni_gallery.php), you can see the results.

I don't have access to the model, nor the normal map, but from early versions, I'm pretty sure most of the prominence of the bones/indentations around the neck is due to normalmap rather than vertex shifts.


You are correct, except that I want this model to work well with Freestyle and other lining methods. Freestyle and Shell lining methods both require there to actually be geometry there, and to have loop flow in the proper direction to mark edges and the like. It's such a hassle :cry:

This project would have been complete long ago if this and topology to produce smooth toon terminators wasn't a factor. But since I expect most people who want to do anime style are going to want to use toon shaders and edge liners, I can't really leave it out either.
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby sonntag78 » Fri Jan 01, 2016 7:34 pm

great target, but you should load and deform the cloth and hair helpers aswell, otherwise no cloth or hair will work right, if you haven't done already ;)
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby duststorm » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:21 am

Wow, I am truly in awe.
Your work is amazing! :)
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby Oscalon » Fri Jan 08, 2016 4:37 am

duststorm wrote:Wow, I am truly in awe.
Your work is amazing! :)


Thanks, here's the latest. There's some more body fixes, but you can't see them as I've now made the clothes >_< Just a few accessories left and this is done, at which point I'll incorporate it's fixes and release the next version of the target.

Nep_WIP-5-web.png
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby duststorm » Sun Jan 10, 2016 11:07 am

Damn, stunning...

Are you by any chance planning on creating anime clothes for adding to the library? :)
Perhaps a MakeAnime plugin for MH could come with some realtime cartoon shaders, to make it look good in MH as well.
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby Oscalon » Sun Jan 10, 2016 10:48 pm

duststorm wrote:Damn, stunning...

Are you by any chance planning on creating anime clothes for adding to the library? :)
Perhaps a MakeAnime plugin for MH could come with some realtime cartoon shaders, to make it look good in MH as well.


I'm planning on doing a original character with full outfit and hair to add to make human as part of this custom target project. Normally for clothing I use Marvelous Designer, which lets me make clothing relatively quickly. And since it cloth sims everything, no rigging of the clothing is necessary. However, it uses dynamically generated topology, and so is a bit of a mess on the mesh level, and doesn't play well at lower poly count. So to make clothing that could be used in MH, I will have to go through the whole process of retopology, weight painting, etc. So it's a lot more work than I normally do for my own projects.
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby Oscalon » Mon Jan 11, 2016 12:13 pm

And today's update:

Nep_WIP-6-web.png


This is still mostly modeling related to the clothing, but now I have it in a much more advanced lighting setup. In the past, I was usually using 1 sun lamp + white world. Now I'm working with some scene geometry (reflecting light) and a mesh fill light, which changes the game a bunch.

This isn't directly related to developing the MakeHuman target, and people not using Cycles or another globally illuminated render enging (in other words, most people doing anime style) won't care, but it's good to know that the face topology has held up in more advanced lighting setups. My development style of doing full characters is slow, and I apologize if that frustrates anyone waiting to use this, but it means that it actually gets tested through all the steps of production, which has already helped me find a lot of optimizations. It's slow, but we'll have higher quality this way (and it takes me a lot of fiddling to figure out wtf i'm doing :? )
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby duststorm » Mon Jan 11, 2016 4:39 pm

Oscalon wrote:it uses dynamically generated topology, and so is a bit of a mess on the mesh level, and doesn't play well at lower poly count

Just an idea, but the auto retpo of ZBrush (ZRemesh) is pretty amazing at generating a quad mesh, perhaps you could try that. It would probably give you an amazing quad mesh in one-click.

Perhaps there are other tools that offer similarly good (auto) retopo tools
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Re: Anime style custom target test version

Postby Oscalon » Mon Jan 11, 2016 11:08 pm

duststorm wrote:
Oscalon wrote:it uses dynamically generated topology, and so is a bit of a mess on the mesh level, and doesn't play well at lower poly count

Just an idea, but the auto retpo of ZBrush (ZRemesh) is pretty amazing at generating a quad mesh, perhaps you could try that. It would probably give you an amazing quad mesh in one-click.

Perhaps there are other tools that offer similarly good (auto) retopo tools


I've looked into that one actually, and it does pretty well and is commonly used with MD. It does require some cleanup. I mostly do my retopo with the Countours/Polystrips addon in blender, which is one of the best out there right now. Including Zbrush in the workflow would speed it up slightly, but it's expensive, and it won't let me avoid having to do a lot of hand tweaking. This is because I have to be very careful with fold and seam lines. They need to stay sharp and clean to work with Freestyle, but these are the areas handled the worst by auto meshers. If I was just making, say, a pair of pants or a loose dress, Zbrush would handle it fine. But retopoing those without zbrush isn't much of a problem anyhow. But if I'm doing something like a pleated skirt, or with multiple layers, or with lots of seam lines that need to be preserved, I'll have to do a lot by hand anyhow. It's another case of Freestyle and Cycles forcing you to play on hard mode when it comes to topology.

I'll probably grab zbrush if/when I have some spare cash. Thanks for the thought :)
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